Wed, 4 November 2009  This week we chat about the CVA Hack , Alliance disbanding mechanics and Hulkageddon. Also storytime with Dillon makes a long awaited return when an Ushra'khan roaming gang snags a Slyph alliance mothership. Enjoy Show Notes! http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1208860 Comments[12] |
GJ as ever guys.
The thing that surprisd me about the CVA thing was that a whole variety of their enemies were pretty cool about the whole thing. Even hardcore PvP'rs are warm and fuzzy sometimes :D
The thing that surprisd me about the CVA thing was that a whole variety of their enemies were pretty cool about the whole thing. Even hardcore PvP'rs are warm and fuzzy sometimes :D
posted by: mandrill on Wed, 11/4 03:46 AM EST
Sorry, commenting as I listen.
Metagaming: it is what EVE is about. So much of the game is based on values that aren't quantified by a mechanic; such as trust, honour, honesty, loyalty and deception. The difficulty of coding a computer to represent these nebulous and ultimately unquantifiable values is monumental, let alon that it would mechanise and regulate an aspect of EVE which would lessen the experience of playing.
When you get right down to it, EVE is a game about relationships. At its core it is about human interaction. Reducing the social aspect of that to a series of numbers would cheapen the whole thing.
Metagaming is not only something to be cherished about EVE, it is essential to the charater of the game. Just as it is in real human reltaionships.
Metagaming: it is what EVE is about. So much of the game is based on values that aren't quantified by a mechanic; such as trust, honour, honesty, loyalty and deception. The difficulty of coding a computer to represent these nebulous and ultimately unquantifiable values is monumental, let alon that it would mechanise and regulate an aspect of EVE which would lessen the experience of playing.
When you get right down to it, EVE is a game about relationships. At its core it is about human interaction. Reducing the social aspect of that to a series of numbers would cheapen the whole thing.
Metagaming is not only something to be cherished about EVE, it is essential to the charater of the game. Just as it is in real human reltaionships.
posted by: mandrill on Wed, 11/4 03:59 AM EST
I think suggesting the ease with which an Alliance can be disbanded is a reason not to change the mechanic because it'd make a spies job harder is a pretty poor point.
Spying and metagaming may be part of Eve, and it's something that makes the game what it is. But I don't think someone should be able to instantly disband a whole alliance when you can't even leave a corp instantly....
Spying and metagaming may be part of Eve, and it's something that makes the game what it is. But I don't think someone should be able to instantly disband a whole alliance when you can't even leave a corp instantly....
posted by: Braxios on Thu, 11/5 10:07 AM EST
Very good podcast. Was pleasantly surprised at the reaction from CVA's enemies - would be a shame to have lost the greates fun PVP region in the game in such a manner and good to see that our enemies are such good sports.
Also good to hear the Sylph mothership story from the "other" side - entertaining narrative.
Hope to see you guys at the F9E gate in D-G some time soon and have a, errr, chat :-D
Also good to hear the Sylph mothership story from the "other" side - entertaining narrative.
Hope to see you guys at the F9E gate in D-G some time soon and have a, errr, chat :-D
Great episode, the mothership story was so funny! Also, re alliance disbanding, although I have posted a proposal in Assembly Hall calling for a change in the mechanics to make disbanding less instant, I agree that infiltrators SHOULD be able to take out an alliance and that any mechanic implemented to keep it from being done instantly should still allow it to be done cleverly.
posted by: Mynxee on Fri, 11/6 09:51 AM EST
Regarding your counter point:
Show me an example of someone infiltrating an alliance with the express purpose of disbanding it like BoB and CVA were disbanded. It doesn't happen. They were disbands-of-opportunity and not long term planned events.
Its far easier to kill alliances with a spy providing intel to enemies, killing its POS and resources, and leading fleets to disaster, all of which kill morale and start the failure cascade, letting an alliance disband itself.
To say we shouldn't make the actual mechanic of disbanding an alliance easier to keep in some metagaming opportunities (which i support BTW) is a poor argument. Alliances, like corporations, should require 24hrs to kill (i.e. remove roles and kicking members from corp should have corresponding timers in alliances).
Show me an example of someone infiltrating an alliance with the express purpose of disbanding it like BoB and CVA were disbanded. It doesn't happen. They were disbands-of-opportunity and not long term planned events.
Its far easier to kill alliances with a spy providing intel to enemies, killing its POS and resources, and leading fleets to disaster, all of which kill morale and start the failure cascade, letting an alliance disband itself.
To say we shouldn't make the actual mechanic of disbanding an alliance easier to keep in some metagaming opportunities (which i support BTW) is a poor argument. Alliances, like corporations, should require 24hrs to kill (i.e. remove roles and kicking members from corp should have corresponding timers in alliances).
posted by: Kirith Kodachi on Fri, 11/6 11:14 AM EST
Hi guys. Thumbs up for the podcasts.
Clearly (apart from being pissheads), you are very adept Eve dwellers, (as opposed to Eve 'players' which I think is a misnomer, Eve is much more than something to merely be 'played').
Love the banter, and the great information that comes out. Being an utter noob it's been refreshing hearing some tips rather than reading the miles of written instructions, handy hints, and flaming (plenty of ego's within the Eve community hey). It's such a huge environment it's pretty easy to be overwhelmed with data and 'underwhelmed' with your own early results.
I would (maybe) throw some sarcasm but am afraid of running foul of a couple of cloaked stealth bombers one day, it's not so much afraid of getting my arse handed back to me after being bombed, but rather War Childe flying into me ... good job there's no breathalyzers out here.
Still have stupid smirk about the black Tshirt with some stars painted on to show off your cloaked bomber.
Okay, enough crap, back to work for me, now just waiting for your convo's after Dominion is released.
RupyTN
Clearly (apart from being pissheads), you are very adept Eve dwellers, (as opposed to Eve 'players' which I think is a misnomer, Eve is much more than something to merely be 'played').
Love the banter, and the great information that comes out. Being an utter noob it's been refreshing hearing some tips rather than reading the miles of written instructions, handy hints, and flaming (plenty of ego's within the Eve community hey). It's such a huge environment it's pretty easy to be overwhelmed with data and 'underwhelmed' with your own early results.
I would (maybe) throw some sarcasm but am afraid of running foul of a couple of cloaked stealth bombers one day, it's not so much afraid of getting my arse handed back to me after being bombed, but rather War Childe flying into me ... good job there's no breathalyzers out here.
Still have stupid smirk about the black Tshirt with some stars painted on to show off your cloaked bomber.
Okay, enough crap, back to work for me, now just waiting for your convo's after Dominion is released.
RupyTN
A new show will be recorded this weekend guys and will be up early next week. It will be another RAW show, however as its likely going to be the last show before Dominion(fingers crossed) after this weeks show we will be returning to the regular show format.
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